Fredeen Blades

hey graham its being a while, how are things with you? Whats new in your shop?

I have a question, i'm looking for a better way to slot my guards and i was wondering where i can find a milling bit to use with my drill press?

Jason

Hey Jason,

It has been awhile. Its a good thing I decided to check for new forum posts, or it probably would have been more than a few days before I saw this.

I've been busy as usual. Unfortunately been out of the shop for the past 2 weeks, but going to hit things hard this comming weekend. If you've looked around the site here you've probably seen the new Coop pictures of my "flaming rose" mosaic fighter, if not I'd suggest taking a look. I've got a few blades/things in the works, as is customary. Got a little basket weave pattern hunter that is ready to get fit up for a guard and handle, and also have another big 1095 fighter with hamon about in the same stage. Also did a feathered jellyroll billet, which didn't quite give the results I was after, but its alright, and I have another nice mosaic billet in the works.

You can get end mills at a number of places. Machine Shop discount supply is one online dealer. I've ordered from another, but the name slips my mind, and needless to say I won't be doing business with them in the future because they really screwed up my last order and the customer service was poor. There are quite a few folks that carry them and google/your favorite search engine should turn up quite a few, maybe even some local suppliers.

What you'll want is a 4 flute , single or doube ended (single ended just means a shank with cutting on one end, and double have both ends with cutting, so its like 2 on one. Single are much cheaper though), square end, endmill, solid carbide.

Basically this: http://www.msdiscount.com/columnar.aspx?cat_id=1136&session_id=864194455&category_site=STARTOOL

Like I said, you'll probably want to do some checking for suppliers and price comparison. Machine shop discount is pretty reputable, but they aren't the only guys out there.

Be sure to order extras, you'll end up breaking a few along the way. They aren't exactly the cheapest things out there ($3+ a piece), but for the time saved, well worth it in my opinion. I use 1/8" the most, probably follwed by 3/16". You'll want to try to match the size you use to your most common tang thicknesses. 

If you're going to try to mill with a drill press, you'll need a "milling vise" for it. They aren't the cheapest things in the world, but are much cheaper than getting a milling machine. Its not going to be as accurate as a mill, but fortunately, you don't need super precision for slotting guards. Harborfreight usually has some that are fairly reasonable:

http://www.harborfreight.com/5-inch-drill-press-milling-vise-94276.html?utm_term=94276&utm_medium=cse&utm_source=googlebase

thanks graham i would have googled it except that i wasn't sure what i was looking for. I'm probably going to get 3 x 1/8" and 2 x 3/16.

I hope this helps because slotting the guard is one of my least favorite things in knife making that and doing the first grit of sand paper after the grinding, i need a better way!

The pictures from coop are great makes your knives look perfect. I have a bowie thats getting near heat treatment time i'm pretty happy with it except for the plunge area, im still having a hard time with that spot. This is a much cleaner piece with better flow and execution, I hope you'll agree. Im just waiting for some PBC for the heat treat.

I know im jumping around alot but bought a welder a few months ago and i'm seriously considering making a a propane forge it just seem like a lot less hassel compared to my char forge. on your forge how much fuel do you use forging? If i make one i definately want it to forge weld in as well as just forging.

Jason

Milling guard slots is the only way to go. I can slot a guard in under 15 min on my mill (probably closer to 5-10). The other thing I'd recommend you get is a file guide, that is invalluable in fitting a guard properly and saves huge amounts of time as well.

When slotting the guard I slot undersized and then do a "press fit." I have a pair of brass jaw covers for my vise, so I clamp the blade with those, put the guard on so it gets tight about 1/4" from the shoulders and then use a pipe with a slotted plate on one end that fits over the tang and then use a big hammer to drive the guard down the remainder of the way. You usually have to do this in a couple stages, and clean up the guard face in between, since you will be deforming the guard and cause it to mushroom out alittle around the shoulders.

As for plunge cuts, one of the best ways of getting a good plunge is with a chainsaw file and file guide. Thats the method some of the best still use. I have an attachement I made for the KMG with a radius that I can use to clean up the plunges. But the chainsaw file method works well. Basically, clean up the flats of your blade, clamp the file guide on where you'd like your plunge to start, then file down to the thickness of your edge and work it up towards the spine. Then when you grind, just grind up to where your round filed groove starts. You can then blend things together when you do your hand sanding. Its time consuming, but produces good results. Unfortunately thats just about how everything is with making a blade, it just sometimes takes a lot of time to do things right and there's not a great deal one can do to avoid it. There are things you can do to expidite certain processes, but with others there's no two ways around it (hand rubbed finishes for example).

As far as my forge goes, its not the most efficient thing in the world, and could do with a few improvements. Considering I built it about 6 years ago and didn't know some of the things I know now, its not been too bad and I have only relined it once (its in despirate need of another reline though). I have a lot of improvements I could make on the design however.

In my opinion a gas forge is the best way to go for bladesmithing. The control it provides, the ease of use, and the speed at which things heat up is ideal. Plus, you can't touch them for forge welding. I wouldn't be able to do half the things I do in my gas forge in a coal/charcoal forge in terms of forge welding with any success.

I couldn't give you exact "gas milage" for my forge as I've never really kept close track. I want to say that I could generally get anywhere from 4-8 hours of forging time on a 20 lb tank, but thats skewed a bit due to the small tanks icing over. I've switched to a 100 lb tank now, and thats even more difficult to keep track of. A blown forge will be a bit more efficient than atmospheric burners, and will generally be able to get a bit hotter, but I would say efficiency wise the differences aren't going to be super drastic, and the extra temp isn't needed. There are better atmospheric burner designs (the side arm) than the ones I used (Reil). I like atmospheric burners due to the portability they provide and no need for a power source (which is handy for my current shop setup, where I don't have many power outlets, especially when you start running compressors for the press, fans, etc). Both work well, and if properly constructed both will forge weld easily.

A caution with forgewelding, you'll want a removable stainless pan to catch the flux, or you'll end up having to reline your forge quite frequently, since borax loves to eat insulation. Sacrificial firebrick floors work, but they still need to be replaced when they get eaten.  Refractory products like Mizzou or bubble alumina are flux resistant, but once they are "dirty" with the flux, they will stay that way for every subsequent use until you change things out. So if you set a piece of clean steel on them, you'll get bits of flux on it, when you probably don't want to. The stainless pan that you can pull in and out is the best fix for this issue I can think of.